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Is John 6:66 the answer to 666 riddle? |
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John 6:66
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Please note that the chapter and verse divisions are not inspired of God as is the text of the Bible. Rather, they are man made. There are many, many interpretations of the meaning of the number 666, ranging from the ridiculous to the absurd. If you will go to bible.crosswalk.com and click on "Bible Study Tools," you will find links to a dozen respected commentaries online. Looking up John 13:18 in these commentaries will give you far more insight into the signficance of the number 666 than I could possibly provide in one brief answer.
. . . Here is a short answer to your question: "When Antichrist is finally revealed, there will be some way to identify him with this basic number of a man, or his name may have the numerical equivalent of 666 . . . Because this text reveals very little about the meaning of 666, it is unwise to speculate beyond what is said" in the text. (MacArthur Study Bible, p. 2011) |
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God will not erase names of Christians. |
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NT general
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Rev 3:5 "Book of Life." A divine journal records the names of all those whom God has chosen to save and who, therefore, are to possess eternal life ( Rev 13:8; 17:8; 20:12, 15; 21:27,: 22:19; compare Dan 12:1; Luke 10:20). Under no circumstances will He erase those names . . . , as city officials often did of undesirable people on their roles. (MacArthur Study Bible, p. 1996)
. . . Phil 4:3. "Book of Life." In eternity past, God registered all the names of His elect in that book which identifies those inheritors of eternal life . . . (MacArthur Study Bible, p. 1828).
. . . When were our names written in the book of life? "From the foundation of the world." Before the first man was ever born, the names of the elect were written in the book of life.
. . . Rev 17:8 NASB
"The beast that you saw was, and is not, and is about to come up out of the abyss and go to destruction. And those who dwell on the earth, whose name has not been written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, will wonder when they see the beast, that he was and is not and will come."
. . . 13:8 (NASB)
All who dwell on the earth will worship him, everyone whose name has not been written from the foundation of the world in the book of life of the Lamb who has been slain.
. . . "Lamb slain". The Lord Jesus who died to purchase the salvation of those whom God had chosen was fulfilling an eternal plan.
. . . "from the foundation of the world". According to God's eternal, electing purpose before creation, the death of Christ seals the redemption of the elect forever (compare Acts 2:23; 4:27, 28). Antichrist can never take away the salvation of the elect. The eternal registry of the elect will never be altered, nor will the saved in the Antichrist's day worship him. (MacArthur Study Bible, p. 2010) |
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BOOK OF LIFE |
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NT general
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Rev 3:5 "Book of Life." A divine journal records the names of all those whom God has chosen to save and who, therefore, are to possess eternal life ( Rev 13:8; 17:8; 20:12, 15; 21:27,: 22:19; compare Dan 12:1; Luke 10:20). Under no circumstances will He erase those names . . . , as city officials often did of undesirable people on their roles. (MacArthur Study Bible, p. 1996) . . . Phil 4:3. "Book of Life." In eternity past, God registered all the names of His elect in that book which identifies those inheritors of eternal life . . . (MacArthur Study Bible, p. 1828). . . . When were our names written in the book of life? "From the foundation of the world." Before the first man was ever born, the names of the elect were written in the book of life. . . . Rev 17:8 NASB "The beast that you saw was, and is not, and is about to come up out of the abyss and go to destruction. And those who dwell on the earth, whose name has not been written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, will wonder when they see the beast, that he was and is not and will come." . . . 13:8 (NASB) All who dwell on the earth will worship him, everyone whose name has not been written from the foundation of the world in the book of life of the Lamb who has been slain. . . . "Lamb slain". The Lord Jesus who died to purchase the salvation of those whom God had chosen was fulfilling an eternal plan. . . . "from the foundation of the world". According to God's eternal, electing purpose before creation, the death of Christ seals the redemption of the elect forever (compare Acts 2:23; 4:27, 28). Antichrist can never take away the salvation of the elect. The eternal registry of the elect will never be altered, nor will the saved in the Antichrist's day worship him. (MacArthur Study Bible, p. 2010) |
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Pre Wrath Rapture? |
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1 Thessalonians
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For starters... do you agree with this "definition" of Pre Wrath Rapture? I mean do you believe it is correct?
The position that the true church will be raptured when the great tribulation by Antichrist, inspired by Satan, is cut short by God's day-of-the-Lord wrath,(Matt. 24:22) which will occur between the sixth and seventh seals of Revelation, sometime during the second half of the seventieth week. (cf. Rev. 7:9-17) The persecution associated with the great tribulation of Antichrist is viewed as the wrath of Satan, whereas the events that follow
beginning with the seventh seal, are considered the wrath of God.
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What is the point? |
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1 Thessalonians
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Dear charis… there are major differences between "date setting" and attempting to understand the "timing" of Christ's return! Coming to a conclusion, through study of Scripture, about the accuracy of the Pre Wrath Rapture position is a very healthy and needed Biblical exercise. Remember, I am Arminian and believe very deeply that apostasy is possible. Let me elaborate on the impact of this. First, if the Pre Wrath Rapture is correct, the church will enter the seventieth week of Daniel to encounter the difficulties of that period and the Antichrist himself. If it does so, having been taught and convinced of an imminent pretribulation Rapture and the absence of any personal tribulation or persecution (because you are already raptured), the consequences will be calamitous. The church will enter that period unprepared, spiritually naked, vulnerable, and ripe for the Antichrist's deception. A questioning of the trustworthiness of the Word of God will naturally follow. It could be a spiritual catastrophe - a "Pearl Harbor" of incalculable proportions - a satanically planed sneak attack. I totally agree with your admonition to live a life of expectancy and to get with the program. Perhaps here is the ultimate error of pretrib rapturism. It holds out the false hope of imminent rapture, instead of the true hope of "expectant" rapture. What Scripture does teach is "expectancy" as you so often exhort charis. Any generation could be called upon to enter the seventieth week of Daniel and there, in the midst of adversity, to remain true (remember the Arminian blood). But with the certain hope that those who endure to the end will be delivered by rapture before the Day of the Lord wrath is poured out on the unregenerate world. They will not know the hour or the day, but they will know the general time period. I believe that Pre Wrath Rapture teaching becomes a supreme catalyst for holy living (2 Peter 3:11). Charis, if what the church has been taught… no persecution… no tribulation… straight to heaven on a cloud… turns out to be incorrect… then apostasy will bloom. It will become very easy to doubt the Word of God (as you were taught it) if you are a pretriber… going through the portion of the Tribulation enacted by Satan. So let me answer your gentle question about "Why would you want to?" by saying that I believe the church should be prepared for a portion of what we call the Tribulation or she will flounder under the attack of Satan and many saved souls will become apostate. The church will be unprepared to evangelize the lost world. This plus the previously mentioned belief that Pre Wrath Rapture teaching is a genuine catalyst to holy living is my response. Blessings! |
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What is the point? |
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1 Thessalonians
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Matthew 24:24.
Dear EveryHome:
I quote from your message:
. . . "The church will enter that period unprepared, spiritually naked, vulnerable, and ripe for the Antichrist's deception. . . .
. . . if what the church has been taught… no persecution… no tribulation… straight to heaven on a cloud… turns out to be incorrect… then apostasy will bloom. It will become very easy to doubt the Word of God (as you were taught it) if you are a pretriber . . ."
. . . Your comments seem to contradict Matt 24:24, where it says:
. . . Matt 24:24 (KJV) "For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect."
. . . The key phrase here is "if it were possible."
. . . (See also John 6:37; Rom 8:28) |
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SECOND CHANCE |
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Rev 7:1
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"Concerning your second question about the impossibility of being saved during the tribulation period if one had heard the gospel before the rapture occurred--I taught this for many years but then discovered some new light on this subject while studying Acts Chapter 2. This chapter covers the tribulation hour and verse 21 dogmatically declares that 'whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved'. The text in II Thessalonians 2:9-12 in context sees the antichrist enthroned. Those who trust him (antichrist) and receive the mark because of the strong delusion permeating the world are the ones who are condemned. See Revelation 14:11. I hope this helps." |
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Point of No Return |
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Revelation
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"Concerning your second quesiton about the impossibility of being save[d] during the tribulation period if one had heard the gospel before the rapture occurred--I taught this for many years but then discovered some new light on this subject while studying Acts Chapter 2. This chapter covers the tribulation hour and verse 21 dogmatically declares that 'whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved'. The text in II Thessalonians 2:9-12 in context sees the antichrist enthroned. Those who trust him (antichrist) and receive the mark because of the strong delusion permeating the world are the ones who are condemned. See Revelation 14:11. I hope this helps." |
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The beast with seven heads |
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Revelation
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My take on it is that this beast represents the Revived Roman empire. The one with a deadly wound that lives is the Antichrist. This is a very deep question that would take much more time than is allowed here.... |
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Point of No Return |
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Revelation
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The Bible speaks of the False Prophet and the Antichrist of deceiving the very elect, if it were possible. I believe that all whom God has given to Christ in the Covenant of Grace which took place before the foudation of the world will come to Him. There's nothing the devil can do to thwart God's plans.
God bless. |
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Spiritual beings procreate? |
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Gen 6:4
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Were the sons of God angels? This is one theory. However, to take such a vague reference as this and expand it with several layers of (potential, not definite) logic to arrive at a point of declaring that demons can procreate with humans is WAY BEYOND anything indicated in the Scriptures and is very poor hermeneutics. The idea that the "sons of God" here were angels is complete speculation -- as are other theories about the origin of the Nephilim.
The most logical speculation, based on the evidence available to us, is that the "sons of God" is simply a reference to powerful lords of great strength and-or cunning who gave themselves that term in order to advance and raise themselves above the people; Nimrod could easily have become one of these later, as well, if it hadn't been for God's intervention at Babel. This would be a corrupting influence and would fit with the context. There are also MANY examples of leaders in more recent history that have declared themselves to have (or have been treated as having) divine ancestry. For example, the Japanese Emperor was considered divine until he officially declared himself otherwise in 1945 -- and only when his military was left with absolutely no other choice. The Antichrist will, likewise, claim divinity.
This makes much more sense than starting a slide down a hill (with no real evidence of corresponding parrallels in other written history) leading to sensational (and completely speculative) stories of demons procreating with humans.
Another purely speculative idea is that Adam and Eve had other children before the fall, who were then removed from them when their parents sinned. If there had been such children, who didn't fall into sin as their parents had, they could have been adopted by God -- thus "sons of God" -- and the males may have (unsuccessfully) tried to help limit the spread of evil by marrying with the women prior to the flood, then returned to the garden and left to be with God in heaven when the garden was destroyed. This is interesting fantasy but is also completely without any Biblical support and is thus purely speculative with no evidence of anything parrallel in other times.
Once again, the most logical speculation, which fits best with other recorded historical experience, is that the "sons of God" were simply very powerful men who took (or were given) that term falsely as a claim or indication of their earthly greatness. |
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Church Age? |
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Acts 2:17
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Hey Charis,
A couple of thoughts about Peter's statement in Acts 2:17 and the prophecy in Joel that he quotes. First, everything that Joel said would happen in the last days did not happen in Acts 2, I mean the signs in the sky,
(Joel 2:30) And I will show wonders in the heavens and in the earth, blood, and fire, and pillars of smoke.
(Joel 2:31) The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before the great and the terrible day of the LORD come.
Unless it refers back to when Christ died on the cross, there was darkness and an earthquake.
I think Peter was inspired when he used the prophecy, but it was not completely fulfilled on that day. It is a prophecy with a double fulfillment so to speak. (Some would call it a partial fulfillment, with the complete fulfillment to come at the appointed time) The ultimate fulfillment will come in the last days, which we live in, during the Day of the Lord, all of the signs given by Joel will happen.
I talked about this a little in my posting of 3-26-01 to your question on whether prophecy was dead or not, I think that was you.
Second, in Joel, he talks about many other things happening that we are (at least I think am) pretty sure that they will not happen until the Day of the Lord, when Christ returns to defeat antichrist and establish His kingdom.
I also think the last days to some extent covers what we call the Church age, and that we are nearing the end of time as we know it.
Also, maybe just to incite conversation, even though Peter and Paul, esp. Paul, were inspired by the Holy Spirit in their preaching and teaching, I think they were very free with some of their applications of O. T. scripture, I mean sometime I read something of Paul where he refers back to some O.T. teaching and I can't figure out how he arrived at that, except the Lord told him.
I hope this not to confusing, sometime the things that I think are clear to me, but I can't get them across to others very clear.
later...wdc
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do churches need to be founded by an apo |
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2 Timothy
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My question was should people who believe in casting out devils and healing the sick have fellowship with those who do not? I believe if we are true to the gospel these signs will follow our preaching of the gospel of Jesus christ. If these signs are not present we are not even accomplishing salvation for the people attending because we are obviously preaching "another gospel" without power or truth. That is a gospel of antichrist and what fellowship does light have with darkness? |
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Jesus said for those who follow him he |
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Matt 12:48
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(NASB) Matt 10:34 "Do not think that I came to bring peace on the earth; I did not come to bring peace, but a sword.
Matt 10:35 "For I came to SET A MAN AGAINST HIS FATHER, AND A DAUGHTER AGAINST HER MOTHER, AND A DAUGHTER-IN-LAW AGAINST HER MOTHER-IN-LAW;
Matt 10:36 and A MAN'S ENEMIES WILL BE THE MEMBERS OF HIS HOUSEHOLD.
Matt 10:37 "He who loves father or mother more than Me is not worthy of Me; and he who loves son or daughter more than Me is not worthy of Me."
. . . "It is true that Christ came to bring peace -- peace between the believer and God, and peace among men. Yet the inevitable result of Christ's coming is conflict -- between Christ and the antichrist, between light and darkness, between Christ's children and the devil's children. This conflict can occur even between members of the same family" (p. 1382, Zondervan NASB Study Bible, Zondervan, 1999). |
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Who's sinning? |
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Col 3:9
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Lionstrong,
Let me share what I believe about sin as taught from scripture. You may disagree, but please hear me out.
Unfortunately, most of the time, when we think of 'sin,' because we are raised in a performance- oriented society, we think that sin is primarily wrong acts that we commit (or right acts that we don't). But I believe that acts of sin are a RESULT of a wrong belief system, an end result of wrong thinking. Now, this is not some metaphysical mumbo-jumbo. This is what scripture teaches. Take Romans 14:23 - "But he who doubts is condemned if he eats, because his eating is not from faith; and whatever is not from faith is sin." Granted, Paul here is addressing what is proper to eat and not eat, but he has shared an important insight. Faith, in it's simplest form, is believing what God says and, because you believe it, acting accordingly.
Consider Adam and Eve. The serpent deceived them by tempting them, not necessarily to just eat the forbidden fruit, but to doubt what God said. His attack was, "Didn't God say...?" and He, of course, twisted what God said to serve his own purposes. Adam and Eve's sin, of first order, was to doubt what God said was TRUE. That is where sin starts. It is born of unbelief in what God says. When this doubt gives birth, it is the act of sinning. Because Adam and Eve did give into to the tempter, they doubted what God said, and that doubt was acted out through their bodies (they ate the fruit). This is why Paul says, "Whatever is not of faith (believing what God says about a thing) is SIN." That wrong belief (sin) will be acted out (sinning, sins) if we doubt what God says.
Now, another important thing about sin is what Jesus said in John 16:8,9 - "And He (the Holy Spirit), when He comes, will convict the world concerning sin and righteousness and judgment;
concerning sin, because they do not believe in Me;
" Jesus has stated here that the world's sin is, not everything they do wrong - their acts, but, rather, their belief system i.e. who do they say that Jesus is, what do they believe about Him. Jesus paid for all our 'sins' - our wrong acts - at the cross. "God was in Christ reconciling the world to Himself, not counting men's sins against them." The only sin that Christ didn't pay for is the sin of unbelief. That is the one sin that MUST be repented of - what do you say about Jesus Christ? Is He who He says He is? That sin, unbelief in Christ, cannot be forgiven, it must be repented of. You must change your mind about who Christ is. This is the illusive 'unpardonable sin.' If a man does not accept Christ for who He said He is, then he stays dead in his sin - his unbelief.
Now, in conclusion, let's look at 1 John. In chapter 1, John is addressing some teaching that had crept into the assembly from the Gnostics. Amongst other things, the Gnostics claimed that:
1) they had fellowship with God but walked in darkness - unbelief (if you have time, use your concordance and study the word 'darkness' in the N.T. - it is always used in reference to belief and unbelief) (vs.6). Because of this, they lie and do not practice the truth. Once again, unbelief results in sin.
2) they said they have no sin (vs. 8) and are thereby self-deceived and the truth is not in them (note 2 John 1:2).
3) they never sinned, thereby calling God a liar and His Word (who is the Word) is NOT in them.
4) that Jesus did not come in the flesh, refuted by John in vs.1-3.
These Gnostics (and anyone who held to their teaching) could not be believers, true Christians. In fact, later, John calls them 'antiChrists.'
Now, same author, same book, let's look at your question. Here is where John says, "Whoever has been born of God (a believer in Jesus Christ) does not sin (not believe in Jesus Christ), for His seed (the Holy Spirit, who testifies of Christ) remains in him; and he cannot sin (not believe in Christ and what Christ did), because he has been born of God.”(NJKV)
In fact, vs. 5 says that Christ appeared to take away sins (the punishment for wrong acts, spiritual death) and in Him is no sin (the unbelieving sin nature we are born with). And vs. 6 says, 'No one who abides in Him (grafted in by the Holy Spirit at conversion) sins (stops believing in Christ); no one who sins has seen Him or knows Him (another stab at the Gnostics).
Brother, this CANNOT be an act or acts of sinning (committing wrong doing). EVERYONE (except Christ) does wrong in God's sight. We have all fallen short. If we take 1 John 3:6 as an understanding of an wrong act, then NO ONE knows God. If we, based on the context of the book, and what God says elsewher about sin, understand that it is NOT BELIEVING in Christ, then there is no contradiction. I will leave the conclusion to you.
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Divine Healing? |
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Matthew
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First of all one must understand the purpose of the Holy Spirit being sent forth, it was sent forth to bare witness to truth, threw powerful works, in other words its to prove who Gods true ministers are and true disciples of that ministry and those powerful works are the gifts of the Spirit- Healings, prophesying, tongues, and so on. This is why you don’t see many of those works today, God said concerning are days there would be no truth, that’s why he’s sending forth another profit in are day, to set all things strait and these are his days, in a short time he will be sent forth, but when he comes the worlds ministry will declare him evil, because he comes forth in the same manner as the antichrist, appearing to be the antichrist, because he will teach against the worlds ministry, this is why I made the comment about Moses and the Israelites, majority doesn’t always mean truth. As fare as faith healings God dos permit faith healing in curtain instances to build and maintain faith, other wise faith would have be lost as well as truth |
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CHRIST IS jehovah |
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Bible general Archive 1
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RevC: you made this statement:I fully expect a massive revival not in the church but of the church.
This is what brings that revival-
(Matt 17:11 NKJ)
Jesus answered and said to them, "Indeed, Elijah is coming first and will restore all things.
(Isa 52:5-6 NKJ)
Now therefore, what have I here," says the LORD, "That My people are taken away for nothing? Those who rule over them make them wail," says the LORD, "And My name is blasphemed continually every day. Therefore My people shall know My name; therefore they shall know in that day that I am He who speaks: 'Behold, it is I.'" (Isa 11:11-12 NKJ) It shall come to pass in that day that the LORD shall set His hand again the second time to recover the remnant of His people who are left, from Assyria and Egypt, from Pathros and Cush, from Elam and Shinar, from Hamath and the islands of the sea.
(Mal 4:5-6 NKJ)
“Behold”, I will send you Elijah the prophet before the coming of the great and dreadful day of the LORD. (The tribulation)
And he will turn the hearts of the fathers to the children, and the hearts of the children to their fathers, lest I come and strike the earth with a curse."
(Isa 42:19)Who is blind but My servant, or deaf as My messenger whom I send? Who is blind as he who is perfect, and blind as the LORD'S servant? (Isa53:2-4 NWT)He will come up like a twig before one, and like a root out of waterless land. No stately form does he have, nor any splendor; and when we shall see him, there is not the appearance so that we should desire him. A man of sorrows and acquainted with grief. And we hid, as it were, our faces from Him. (Isa 52:14 NKJ) Just as many were astonished at you, so His visage was marred more than any man, Truly our sicknesses were what he himself carried; and as for our pains, he bore them. But we ourselves accounted him as plagued, stricken by God and afflicted.
He was despised and was avoided by men, a man meant for pains and for having acquaintance with sickness. And there was as if the concealing of one's face from us. He was despised, and we held him as of no account. (Isa 53:10 NIV) Yet it was the LORD's will to crush him and cause him to suffer, and though the LORD makes his life a guilt offering, he will see his offspring and prolong his days, and the will of the LORD will prosper in his hand. ( Isa 42:25 NKJ)Therefore He has poured on him the fury of His anger and the strength of battle; it has set him on fire all around, yet he did not know; and it burned him, yet he did not take it to heart.
(Isa 11:12 NKJ) He will set up a banner for the nations, and will assemble the outcasts of Israel, and gather together the dispersed of Judah from the four corners of the earth. He shall see the labor of His soul, and be satisfied. (Isa 53:11 NIV) By His knowledge My righteous Servant shall justify many, for He shall bear their iniquities.
(Matt 11:14 NKJ)"And if you are willing to receive it, he is Elijah who is to come
He is the image of John the Baptist, with the Spirit and power of Elijah
He is being sent to open the way for the second coming of the Messiah
( Like a root out of waterless land ) he had no one to guide him, no one to teach him truth, no one to tell him who he was, he had to find his own way. He had to come to know who he was. (Image of Moses)
( His visage was marred more than any man ) visage means the part of him you can see, his face will be marred more than any man, almost as thou, he was wearing a helmet, but he wasn’t born this way, God will make him this way, he will come forth in power and than God will change him, and they will say that God stuck him because he was evil, ( stricken by God and afflicted) because he angered the ministers because he questioned there teachings before there people and he healed those they couldn’t heal, therefore the ministry declares him evil. (The Antichrist) because he comes forth just as the Bible describes the Antichrist)
He will be both blind and death, yet he will both see and hear, but he will not see with his own eyes, he will see with the eyes of the spirit of God, in the same way God sees, and he will not hear sounds or peoples voices, he will hear there thoughts, he will know there hearts, just as God knows there hearts, for God gave this to him. He will be able to reach in to peoples lives where no other man can go, to turn the hearts of the fathers back to the sons and the sons back to the fathers and will restore all things.
And the pleasure of the LORD shall prosper in His hand.
"For there is nothing hidden which will not be revealed, nor has anything been kept secret but that it should come to light.
"If anyone has ears to hear, let him hear."
These are the days of Elijah
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Jesus earth: God/man or just man? |
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NT general
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Your belief is correct, Zuttione, but you need to show that your belief is supported by the Bible. In the first chapter of John we learn that God became a man. The teaching that your son has been exposed to says that the man Jesus became God. Do you see that this is a clear contradiction of the Bible?
This next point seems to be hard for some people to understand: The Son of God is God. Matt 16:16 Simon Peter answered, "You are the Christ, the Son of the living God."
The Jews understood it. That's why they wanted to kill Jesus. John 5:17 But He answered them, "My Father is working until now, and I Myself am working."
John 5:18 For this reason therefore the Jews were seeking all the more to kill Him, because He not only was breaking the Sabbath, but also was calling God His own Father, making Himself equal with God.
So, Jesus did not become the Son after he left the earth. He was already equal with God while he was on earth.
His many miracles proved that he was the Son. John 20:30 Therefore many other signs Jesus also performed in the presence of the disciples, which are not written in this book;
John 20:31 but these have been written so that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing you may have life in His name.
In fact to deny that God came in the flesh is a mark the the anti-christ. 1 John 4:1 Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, because many false prophets have gone out into the world.
1 John 4:2 By this you know the Spirit of God: every spirit that confesses that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God;
1 John 4:3 and every spirit that does not confess Jesus is not from God; this is the spirit of the antichrist, of which you have heard that it is coming, and now it is already in the world.
To say that Jesus was only a man is the same as saying that this man was not the Son of God. Jesus is the Christ, the Son of the the living God! |
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Why Daniel 9:24-27? |
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Not Specified
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Most conservative protestant churchs use parts of Daniel 9:24-27 to support their belief that at some unknown time the saints will be raptured and then a seven year period will set in and the anitchrist will arise. As these text are prophecies about the first coming of Christ, what rule of Bible interpertation allows them to be used to identify the antichrist? And please don't say it is a "dual" prophecy. Because if that is the case then all 350 prophecies in the Bible that reference Christ would there also reference the antichrist, and we know no one wants to go there. |
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Why Daniel 9:24-27? |
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Dan 9:24
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Most conservative protestant churchs use parts of Daniel 9:24-27 to support their belief that at some unknown time the saints will be raptured and then a seven year period will set in and the anitchrist will arise. As these text are prophecies about the first coming of Christ, what rule of Bible interpertation allows them to be used to identify the antichrist? And please don't say it is a "dual" prophecy. Because if that is the case then all 350 prophecies in the Bible that reference Christ would there also reference the antichrist, and we know no one wants to go there. |
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Why Daniel 9:24-27? |
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Dan 9:24
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Because they want to say the ruler is the antichrist.
They want to have a gap between the 69th and 70th week.
While it is possible to have a dual prophecy, it do not think so. Unless, the 70 "sevens" just started.
Steve
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Why Daniel 9:24-27? |
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Daniel
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Most conservative protestant churchs use parts of Daniel 9:24-27 to support their belief that at some unknown time the saints will be raptured and then a seven year period will set in and the anitchrist will arise. As these text are prophecies about the first coming of Christ, what rule of Bible interpertation allows them to be used to identify the antichrist? And please don't say it is a "dual" prophecy. Because if that is the case then all 350 prophecies in the Bible that reference Christ would there also reference the antichrist, and we know no one wants to go there. |
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Why Daniel 9:24-27? |
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Daniel
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Great question Mike! Daniel 9:24-27 speaks of the time between the decree authorizing the rebuilding of Jerusalem (v. 25) and the coming of the Messiah, which was to be 69 weeks or 483 years. The final (70th) 'week' is not mentioned until v. 27, following the prophecy of the destruction of Jerusalem by 'the people of the prince who is to come" (some see this as Titus in A.D. 70, others point to this 'prince' as the antichrist.) It is not clearly referring to the antichrist, that is only an assumption that seems to fit the facts for now. Daniel 11:31 also speaks of this and the 'abomination of desolation'. In no way do I see any reference whatsoever to a rapture here. In fact, this passage (v. 27) could be referring to Messiah instituting the new covenant and putting 'a stop' to the OT sacrificial system, since it clearly speaks of Christ (the Messiah) and His crucifixion in v. 26. But Endtime 'prophesiers' like to use this and other verses to establish future events based on an 'antichrist'. However, in several instances they are bringing meaning to the text that just is not there to begin with. |
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Why Daniel 9:24-27? |
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Daniel
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Only churches that hold the pre-millennial, pre-tribulation view will make such statements. For the record, I hold these views myself.
Three terms that are relevant are Millennium, Tribulation, and Rapture.
1) Millennium is a period when Jesus Christ reigns over the earth. It is stated to be 1000 years long.
2) Tribulation is a period when God will pour judgment upon the earth in a manner that he has not yet done. It is stated to be seven years long.
3) Rapture is the removal of the members of the Body of Christ (The Church) from the earth.
The pre-millennial view states that there will be a literal 1000 year rule by Jesus Christ on this earth at some future time and that Jesus will return to earth physically immediately before this.
The pre-tribulation view -- a subdivision within the pre-millennial view -- states that there will be a literal seven year period of distress upon the earth immediately before the Millennium. This period is referred to as the "seventieth week" of Daniel which relates it to the passage you cite. The view further states that "The Church," that is all those who have received Jesus Christ as their personal savior, will be spared this time of tribulation which God will pour out on the earth by being "caught up" in the Rapture. The Tribulation is outlined through most of the book of Revelation.
The passage you cite does not mention the Rapture.
Here are some passages of scripture that have been taken to refer to the Rapture:
1) Just before John starts describing the events of the Tribulation, he is told, "Come up here" (Rev 4:1). Some see this as the rapture of the Church since there is no further reference to the Church until after the completion of the description of events that occur during the Tribulation.
2) Jesus, in Matt 24:40-41 while talking about things yet to come makes some statements that are generally interpreted at pertaining to the Rapture.
3) Paul, in I Thess 4:16, while comforting the believers who were concerned that their loved ones who had already died would miss the return of Jesus Christ, discloses that there will be a major event in the future in which both the living and the dead believers will be caught up -- or away.
Some who hold this view make statements that are rather sensationalistic declaring dates for the event and identifying the Antichrist with some current leader with whom they disagree. This has a negative effect on their credibility. One thing that they _must not_ do is go about setting dates. IMHO, identifying certain individuals as the Antichrist is also unwise. My understanding of what Scripture has to say is that the Antichrist will not be revealed until after the Church has been taken out of the earth.
As I say, this is a debated subject. There are those who hold that the Church will go through the first half of the seven year tribulation period. They make a distinction between the Tribulation (the first 42 months) and the Great Tribulation (the last 42 months). And there are those who hold that the Church will go through the entire seven years though, IMHO, how the Church can come with Christ when he returns to set up His millennial kingdom if the rapture occurs at the same time escapes me.
There are also those who hold that the events in the book of Revelation (the tribulation and the millennium) are not meant to be taken as literal events. I will make no attempt to explain their positions. I believe that Hank Hanegraaff of Christian Research Institute tends to hold this view; though to my knowledge, he has not yet declared his position firmly.
IMHO, this is a teaching which we may debate vigorously but it is not one over which we should separate ourselves. |
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How then should we live? |
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Jude 1:21
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Gospel of Christ central theme of prophecy.
Ray: As always, it's good to hear from you. I welcome your question, as it give me the opportunity to expand a bit on my previous answer.
Rev 19:10 (NKJV) *the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy.* "The central theme of both OT prophecy and NT preaching is the gospel of the Lord Jesus Christ" (p.2019, MacArthur Study Bible, Word, 1997).
My point in quoting Rev 19:10 is simply this: The Gospel of Christ is the central theme of prophecy. It is the main purpose of prophecy. I believe that prophecy was not given so we could spend 90 percent of our Bible study time majoring on prophecy.
It means emphasizing the Gospel of Christ, as opposed to splitting hairs over prophecy, trying to predict every detail of every prophecy's fulfillment, endless debates over the meaning of the third toe on the left foot of the beast that Daniel saw in his vision, and, most unprofitable of all, trying to guess the identity of Antichrist. I don't need to know his identity. All I need to know is that the prophecy WILL come to pass, regardless of the name on Antichrist's birth certificate. Who gets to play the role of Antichrist in this end-time drama is of no more interest to me than identifying the two baseball teams that will play in the world series in the year 2045 A.D. |
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Does Jesus divide families? |
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Matt 10:35
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Conflict..."inevitable result of Christ's coming"
Ed:
(NASB) Matt 10:34 "Do not think that I came to bring peace on the earth; I did not come to bring peace, but a sword.
Matt 10:35 "For I came to SET A MAN AGAINST HIS FATHER, AND A DAUGHTER AGAINST HER MOTHER, AND A DAUGHTER-IN-LAW AGAINST HER MOTHER-IN-LAW;
Matt 10:36 and A MAN'S ENEMIES WILL BE THE MEMBERS OF HIS HOUSEHOLD.
Matt 10:37 "He who loves father or mother more than Me is not worthy of Me; and he who loves son or daughter more than Me is not worthy of Me."
. . . "It is true that Christ came to bring peace -- peace between the believer and God, and peace among men. Yet the inevitable result of Christ's coming is conflict -- between Christ and the antichrist, between light and darkness, between Christ's children and the devil's children. This conflict can occur even between members of the same family" (p. 1382, Zondervan NASB Study Bible, Zondervan, 1999).
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define and describe apostasy. |
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Bible general Archive 1
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Apostasy is a defection from the tenets of a religious community. In Acts 21:21, it describes the charge brought against Paul by the Jews- that he taught that the Jews should abandon Mosaism. In 2 Thess 2:3 it describes the defection of Christians which was to accompany the 'man of lawlessness' (or Antichrist). This expectation is an illustration of what seems to have been a common belief- that the return of the Christ to establish His Kingdom would be preceded by exceptional activity on the part of His superhuman opponent, and that this would result in an abandonment of Christian faith on the part of many of those nominally Christian. Other examples of apostasy include Exodus 32:1, Deut. 13:12-13; Judges 2:17, Neh. 9:26, Ezek. 36:20, Acts 7:39, 2 Timothy 4:10, Hebrews 6:6 and 1 John 2:19..There are several warnings against apostasy in 2 Tim. 4:4, Hebrews 3:12, and 2 Peter 3:17.. Nave's Topical Bible (Hendrickson) |
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Book of Life "will never be altered." |
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Rev 3:5
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God's pencil has no eraser.
Rev 3:5 "Book of Life." A divine journal records the names of all those whom God has chosen to save and who, therefore, are to possess eternal life ( Rev 13:8; 17:8; 20:12, 15; 21:27,: 22:19; compare Dan 12:1; Luke 10:20). Under no circumstances will He erase those names . . . , as city officials often did of undesirable people on their roles. (MacArthur Study Bible, p. 1996)
Phil 4:3. "Book of Life." In eternity past, God registered all the names of His elect in that book which identifies those inheritors of eternal life . . . (MacArthur Study Bible, p. 1828).
When were our names written in the book of life? "From the foundation of the world." Before the first man was ever born, the names of the elect were written in the book of life.
Rev 17:8 NASB "The beast that you saw was, and is not, and is about to come up out of the abyss and go to destruction. And those who dwell on the earth, whose name has not been written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, will wonder when they see the beast, that he was and is not and will come."
Rev 13:8 (NASB) All who dwell on the earth will worship him, everyone whose name has not been written from the foundation of the world in the book of life of the Lamb who has been slain.
"Lamb slain". The Lord Jesus who died to purchase the salvation of those whom God had chosen was fulfilling an eternal plan.
"from the foundation of the world". According to God's eternal, electing purpose before creation, the death of Christ seals the redemption of the elect forever (compare Acts 2:23; 4:27, 28). Antichrist can never take away the salvation of the elect. The eternal registry of the elect will never be altered, nor will the saved in the Antichrist's day worship him. (MacArthur Study Bible, p. 2010)
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A true work of the Holy Spirit ? |
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Bible general Archive 1
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Carefully study 1 John 4.
"From a careful study of 1 John 4, the great theologian and pastor Jonathan Edwards was able to identify five distinguishing characteristics of the Holy Spirit's work. In short, a true work of the Holy Spirit: (1) Exalts the true Christ, (2) Opposes Satan's interests, (3) Points people to the Scriptures, (4) Elevates truth, and (5) Results in love for God and others.
"(The following material is condensed, adapted and excerpted from Jonathan Edward's The Distinguishing Marks of a Work of the Spirit of God.)
"How can a true work of the Holy Spirit be distinguished from that which is false?
"It Exalts the True Christ.
"By this you know the Spirit of God: every spirit that confesses that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God; and every spirit that does not confess Jesus is not from God; this is the spirit of the antichrist, of which you have heard that it is coming, and now it is already in the world." (John 4:2-3) When a ministry raises people's esteem of the one true Jesus Christ, who was born of a virgin and was crucified-if it confirms and establishes their minds in the truth that He is the Son of God and the Savior of men-then it is a sure sign that it is from the Spirit of God.
(...)
"It Opposes Satan's Interests
"You are from God, little children, and have overcome them; because greater is He who is in you than he who is in the world. They are from the world; therefore they speak as from the world, and the world listens to them." (1 John 4:4-5)
"When the spirit that is at work operates against the interests of Satan's kingdom, against sin, and against worldly lusts-this is a sure sign that it is a true, and not a false spirit.
(...)
"It Points People to the Scriptures
"We are from God; he who knows God listens to us; he who is not from God does not listen to us. By this we know the spirit of truth and the spirit of error." (1 John 4:6)
"The spirit that causes people to have a greater regard for the Holy Scriptures and establishes them more in the truth and divinity of God's Word is certainly the Spirit of God.
(...)
"Therefore the devil is engaged against the Bible and hates every word in it. We may be sure that he never will attempt to raise anyone's esteem of it.
"It Elevates Truth
"We know the spirit of truth and the spirit of error" (v. 6).
"Another rule by which to judge spirits is that whatever operates as a spirit of truth, leading people to truth, convincing them of those things that are true-we may safely determine that it is a right and true spirit.
(...)
"On the other hand, the spirit of darkness will not uncover and make manifest the truth. Christ tells us that Satan is a liar, and the father of lies.
(...)
"It Results in Love for God and Others
"The one who does not love does not know God, for God is love" (v. 8).
(...)
"We love, because He first loved us," verse 19 says. The spirit that makes the soul long after God and Christ must be the Spirit of God. When we desire the presence and communion of the living Savior, acquaintance with Him, conformity to Him, a life that pleases and honors Him, we must be under the influence of His Spirit.
(...)
"Conclusion
(...)
"The very reason the apostle John gave these marks was so that we could test the spirits. Therefore try the spirits by these rules and you will be able to distinguish the true spirit from the false."
(As appearing in John MacArthur, Reckless Faith [Wheaton, IL: Crossway, 1994], appendix 2, pp. 225-31)
To read the entire article, go to the following web page: http://www.gty.org/IssuesandAnswers/archive/truespirit.htm
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