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Results from: Notes
On or After: Tue 08/25/15 Ordered by Date
Results Type Verse Author Date ID#
1 The Freedom of the Christian Note 1 Cor 9:1 DocTrinsograce Wed 08/24/16, 3:23pm 243512
  "A Christian is a perfectly free lord of all, subject to no one. A Christian is a perfectly dutiful servant of all, subject to all.

"...as Christians we do not live in ourselves but in Christ and the neighbor. Otherwise, we are not Christian. As Christians we live in Christ through faith and in the neighbor through love. Through faith we are caught up beyond ourselves into God, Likewise, through love we descend beneath ourselves through love to serve our neighbor."

--Martin Luther (1520) from his book "The Freedom of the Christian"

2 Evidences that Give Assurance Note Gal 4:7 DocTrinsograce Mon 08/22/16, 2:56pm 243507
  "For Paul, the ability to cry 'Father!' was the work and therefore the evidence of the Spirit of the Son [Galatians 4]. The evidence of the Spirit is first of all Christian faith in God the Father or -- Christian prayer. The Spirit in these parallel texts is deliberately called 'the Spirit of (the) Son(ship),' not only because the Spirit belongs to the Son and is given in him, but because it is the Spirit's work to assure believers that they are, through the Son, truly sons of God. The gift of the Spirit is first of all the subjective assurance of the gift of adoption or justification. The 'objective' justification and the 'subjective' gift of the Spirit cannot be separated for one is acceptance with God and the other is knowledge of this acceptance. And what God has joined together no man should put asunder. The 'objective' justification never remains merely objective but is always accompanied mediately in the Word by its 'subjective' revelation, and this is the first work of the Spirit—this is the Spirit. His evidence is Christian assurance." --Frederick Dale Bruner (1970)

3 Rejoicing in Affliction Note 2 Cor 7:4 DocTrinsograce Sun 08/21/16, 12:56pm 243506
  "The godly do suffer and complain about it at times. But the Bible teaches plainly that their suffering, even after their conversion and reconciliation to God, is not punishment any longer, but chastening. It is not the punishment of a God who is angry with them, but the chastening of a God who is reconciled to them. Whom God loves, the Scriptures says, He chastens. He makes all things, including pain, 'work together for good for them that love God, and are called according to His purpose.' That should be the consolation and strength of the saints... That affliction is actually a blessing in disguise. At other times, the pain hurts so much that they cannot, through the tears, see the disguise. Momentarily they lament the heavy hand of God upon them, but when they are thinking in their most saintly character, they praise God. His rod and staff comfort them." --John Gerstner

4 Proof against election. Note Matt 18:14 DocTrinsograce Sun 08/21/16, 12:41pm 243505
  Shalom aleichem, baruch haba!

I am a Jew, saved by grace alone, through faith alone, in Christ alone. I am saved by works... indeed, I am saved by mighty and wonderful works... the works of God Himself. Consequently, I am quite grateful, praising God daily that He did not leave me to my own choices. If He had, I would never have been saved!

The Greek word pororidzo (predestine) appears in six verses in the New Testament (Romans 8:29, 30; 1 Corinthians 2:7; Ephesians 1:5, and 11). If you are interested in God's sovereign providence, then you would want to understand these verses in their context. Each of these verses speak to your soteriological question.

I am sorry that you have been "dismissed" as you tried "discussing this subject with them." Presumably by "them" you mean orthodox Biblical Christians. I cannot speak to their motivation. I would guess that it has to do with their being simply fed up with people who are more interested in defending their contribution to salvation than they are in the Word. The Scriptures do not elevate man's will above God's. However, not a single religion outside of these doctrines or even outside of Christianity, will admit to God's authority in all things. This is because, as Scripture assures us, that depending on the human heart will lead us only to being deceived (Jeremiah 17:9; Proverbs 28:25). In fact, the Word tells us that those who do so fundamentally lack sanity (Ecclesiastes 9:3b).

Regardless, your problem is not a matter of failing to rightly understand the doctrine of God's predestination. It is more fundamental than that. When you argue about soteriological predestination, it is like arguing about Trigonometry when you still do not agree with the principle of addition and subtraction.

Instead of trying to get people to argue the subject with you on the Internet, I would suggest that you find a pastor in your area with whom you could begin a discussion. He will help you with the basics concerning Scripture. Look for a church who hold to a confession (e.g., Lutheran Missouri Synod, Reformed Church of America, Dutch Reformed, Orthodox Presbyterian, or Reformed Baptist). The confession is what they understand to be the essential doctrines. Those without a confession will -- and do -- believe anything and everything. They will even place some things as having a higher authority than the Scripture.

The pastor that you speak to will be able to articulate all historical perspectives. He will be able to help you in a far more practical way than we might do -- which is, actually, beyond our purview.

Meanwhile, our forum, per our gracious host, the Lockman Foundation, is about Scripture. The Lockman Foundation sponsored the NASB and Amplified translations specifically because they believed that the Bible alone contains all that we must know to believe, to understand, and to obey our Lord. See the Terms of Use.

The Terms of Use give us broad permission to express what we understand from Scripture; provided they are consistent with the eccumenical creeds: Apostles Creed, Nicene Creed, Chalcedonian Creed, and Canons of the Council of Orange. While we all hold the Scriptures as the highest authority, we are functioning in accord with Lockman's objectives.

Although some who participate in our forum hold their denominational praxis as having a higher priority than anything else (you will see them by their operation contrary to the Terms of Use) -- nonetheless, the rest of us will be praying for you specifically as you seriously seek answers to your questions in study in the church in your community. God will always respond when He is sought above all else.

In Him, Doc
5 Tilling the Soil Note Matt 11:5 DocTrinsograce Sat 08/20/16, 5:55pm 243504
  "Now it is perfectly true that men must be brought to Christ one by one. There are no labor-saving devices in evangelism. It is all hand-work. And yet it would be a great mistake to suppose that all men are equally well prepared to receive the gospel. It is true that the decisive thing is the regenerative power of God. That can overcome all lack of preparation, and the absence of that makes even the best preparation useless. But as a matter of fact God usually exerts that power in connection with certain prior conditions of the human mind, and it should be ours to create, so far as we can, with the help of God, those favorable conditions for the reception of the gospel. False ideas are the greatest obstacles to the reception of the gospel. We may preach with all the fervor of a reformer and yet succeed only in winning a straggler here and there, if we permit the whole collective thought of the nation or of the world to be controlled by ideas which, by the resisters force of logic, prevent christianity from being regarded as anything more than a harmless delusion. Under such circumstances, what God desires us to do is to destroy the obstacle at its root. Many would have the seminaries combat error by attacking it as it is taught by its popular exponents. Instead of that they confuse their students with a lot of German names unknown outside the walls of the universities. That method of procedure is based simply upon a profound belief in the pervasiveness of ideas. What is today a matter of academic speculation begins tomorrow to move armies and pull down empires. In that second stage, it has gone too far to be combated; the time to stop it was when it was still a matter of impassioned debate. So as Christians we should try to mold the thought of the world in such a way as to make the acceptance of Christianity something more than a logical absurdity." --J. Gresham Machen (1881-1937)

6 Proof against election. Note Matt 18:14 Lucia7 Sat 08/20/16, 2:29pm 243503
  Shalom! I hope I'm posting this on EdB's "Proof against election." (Kinda new here.) Good point, EdB, thanks for sharing. Hadn't considered this v. in this way before, and had to think about it from the perspective you presented. I think you're saying that since it is NOT God's will for any of these to perish, and yet we know that some of these will perish (have perished), there cannot be "election" or predestined salvation.

I hope some believers in the predestination idea will respond here, so that we can understand how they might view this v. (and similar v.v.). I've tried discussing this subject with them (elsewhere), but have been dismissed with a "you're kidding, right?" Dr. Michael Brown said that he used to believe in predestination because it seemed to him that it was a doctrine held by intelligent believers, but he later came to see it as error.

I would like to understand the bases for opposing viewpoints, so I hope others will respond.

7 Be on Your Guard! Note 2 Pet 3:17 DocTrinsograce Sat 08/20/16, 10:51am 243500
  “There's a way to preach the Bible unbiblically... You can use the Bible as the springboard for all kinds of ideas, can't you? Look around in here and find something that fits your fancy and then launch a rocket off it. People say, 'That was amazing, wasn't it? Remarkable what he got out of that.' Well of course it is because he put it in before he got it out.” --Alistair Begg


8 "Quest for Glory" Note Luke 17:18 DocTrinsograce Sat 08/20/16, 10:33am 243499
  Free book "Quest for Glory" well worth the reading by those who seek the glory of God above that of men:


9 The SBF what does it need to do? Note Bible general justme Fri 08/19/16, 3:57pm 243498
  I believe the NASB to be one of the Best Bibles a person can have for word for word. Thank you goes to Lockman. I honestly believe the SBF is worth saving. I will pray and after the Lord Jesus leading I plan to call Pike and talk with him. Please join me in prayer for the correct words to say.

10 Paul Reading the News over our Shoulder? Note 2 Tim 3:4 DocTrinsograce Fri 08/19/16, 2:28pm 243497
  "But realize this, that in the last days difficult times will come. For men will be lovers of self, lovers of money, boastful, arrogant, revilers, disobedient to parents, ungrateful, unholy, unloving, irreconcilable, malicious gossips, without self-control, brutal, haters of good, treacherous, reckless, conceited, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God, holding to a form of godliness, although they have denied its power; Avoid such men as these. For among them are those who enter into households and captivate weak women weighed down with sins, led on by various impulses, always learning and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth. Just as Jannes and Jambres opposed Moses, so these men also oppose the truth, men of depraved mind, rejected in regard to the faith. But they will not make further progress; for their folly will be obvious to all, just as Jannes's and Jambres's folly was also." (2 Timothy 3:1-9)
11 Blessed are They Who Know God Note Is 43:12 DocTrinsograce Fri 08/19/16, 2:15pm 243496
  "Blessed, indeed, are the people who know this God who is God blessed forever. It is true that God is God, and therefore he cannot be comprehended. The finite cannot comprehend the infinite; time cannot compass eternity. But there is a difference between knowledge and comprehension, and comprehension is not necessary for knowledge. Although in the very testimony that God is God the church confesses that God cannot be comprehended, she also proclaims that He is knowable, and that He is known. He is known because He has revealed Himself. He has revealed Himself not merely as god, but also as the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who loves His church with an eternal and unfathomable love; who reconciles His people to Himself, not imputing their trespasses to them; who delivers them from the power of sin and death; and who gives them life eternal in the knowledge of Himself.

"We know God in Christ Jesus our Lord, and not merely with our head, intellectually, as theology knows Him; we also know Him with our heart, spiritually, so that we taste that He is good and the overflowing fountain of all good. We know Him and have fellowship with Him, and we hear Him tell us that we are His friends, His sons and daughters. We know Him, and in this knowledge we have eternal life. 'This is life eternal, that they might know Thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom Thou hast sent' (John 17:3).

"Let the church of Jesus Christ in the world clearly understand her calling and emphatically proclaim -- always and everywhere -- that God is God!" --Reverend Herman Hoeksema

12 Salvation is open to all! Note 2 Pet 3:9 EdB Fri 08/19/16, 10:14am 243495
2 Peter 3:9 (NASB)
9 The Lord is not slow about His promise, as some count slowness, but is patient toward you, not wishing for any to perish but for all to come to repentance.

Matthew 18:13-14 (NASB)
13 "If it turns out that he finds it, truly I say to you, he rejoices over it more than over the ninety-nine which have not gone astray.
14 "So it is not the will of your Father who is in heaven that one of these little ones perish.

Mark 10:26-27 (NASB)
26 They were even more astonished and said to Him, "Then who can be saved?"
27 Looking at them, Jesus said, "With people it is impossible, but not with God; for all things are possible with God."

Luke 2:10 (NASB)
10 But the angel said to them, "Do not be afraid; for behold, I bring you good news of great joy which will be for all the people;

Luke 3:6 (NASB)

Luke 14:20-21 (NASB)
20 "Another one said, 'I have married a wife, and for that reason I cannot come.'
21 "And the slave came back and reported this to his master. Then the head of the household became angry and said to his slave, 'Go out at once into the streets and lanes of the city and bring in here the poor and crippled and blind and lame.'

John 6:40 (NASB)
40 "For this is the will of My Father, that everyone who beholds the Son and believes in Him will have eternal life, and I Myself will raise him up on the last day."

Romans 1:16 (NASB)
16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel, for it is the power of God for salvation to everyone who believes, to the Jew first and also to the Greek.

Romans 5:18 (NASB)
18 So then as through one transgression there resulted condemnation to all men, even so through one act of righteousness there resulted justification of life to all men.

Romans 10:13 (NASB)

1 Timothy 2:3-4 (NASB)
3 This is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior,
4 who desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth.

Titus 2:11 (NASB)
11 For the grace of God has appeared, bringing salvation to all men,

Hebrews 2:9 (NASB)
9 But we do see Him who was made for a little while lower than the angels, namely, Jesus, because of the suffering of death crowned with glory and honor, so that by the grace of God He might taste death for everyone.

1 John 2:2 (NASB)
2 and He Himself is the propitiation for our sins; and not for ours only, but also for those of the whole world.

13 Proof against election. Note Matt 18:14 EdB Fri 08/19/16, 9:34am 243494
  Proof against election.
14 Our Central Problem Note Josh 24:27 EdB Fri 08/19/16, 9:25am 243493
  How true and how very many deny the power of the Holy Spirit choosing instead to explain away any manifestation of the Holy Spirit with their intellect and logic.
15 Bad verse for predestination Note Luke 6:43 EdB Fri 08/19/16, 9:17am 243492
  Someone used this verse as a proof text for election.
However before salvation we are all bad trees producing bad fruit. Therefore this verse does not support election.
16 Free will, or ? Note Rom 9:16 Lionstrong Thu 08/18/16, 5:06pm 243490
  Psa. 65:4
How blessed is the one whom You choose and bring near to You
To dwell in Your courts.
We will be satisfied with the goodness of Your house,
Your holy temple.

Thanks for you thoughts, Doc.
17 Our Central Problem Note Josh 24:27 DocTrinsograce Thu 08/18/16, 11:40am 243489
  "The central problem of our age is not liberalism or modernism, nor the old Roman Catholicism or the new Roman Catholicism, nor the threat of communism, nor even the threat of rationalism and the monolithic consensus which surrounds us. All these are dangerous but not the primary threat. The real problem is this: the church of the Lord Jesus Christ, individually corporately, tending to do the Lord’s work in the power of the flesh rather than of the Spirit. The central problem is always in the midst of the people of God, not in the circumstances surrounding them.” --Francis Schaeffer from his book "No Little People"

18 Free will, or ? Note Rom 9:16 DocTrinsograce Thu 08/18/16, 11:36am 243488
  Hi, Lionstrong...

I hope you are doing well... and continue to be as strong as a lion!

Many modern teachers try to reduce the problem of "free will" to having the choice to turn left or turn right, to have eggs for breakfast, or cereal, etc. That entirely avoids the actual historic question in the church as to what we mean by free will. By dumbing it down to something as simplistic as this, who would possibly adhere to such a view?

In theology we understand free will as meaning, the "ability to make choices without any prior prejudice, inclination, or disposition." The crux of the matter is the nature of the one making the choice. Keeping it simple for everyone, we might ask, for example, does a cat have the freedom of will to be bird? Does a man have the freedom of will to be a tree?

The Bible states quite clearly that anything and anyone can only be what their nature allows them to be. God makes it quite plain through his prophet Jeremiah: "Can the Ethiopian change his skin Or the leopard his spots? Then you also can do good Who are accustomed to doing evil." (Jeremiah 13:23)

Over and over we see things like this:

Solomon said, "Though you pound a fool in a mortar with a pestle along with crushed grain, Yet his foolishness will not depart from him." (Proverbs 27:22)

Christ said, "For there is no good tree which produces bad fruit, nor, on the other hand, a bad tree which produces good fruit." (Luke 6:43)

Again, the Word says quite clearly, "But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God, even to those who believe in His name, who were born, not of blood nor of the will of the flesh nor of the will of man, but of God."

Paul, in his systematic theology, the epistle to the Romans, quite clearly assert that redemption is a matter of God's choice, not man's choice. Men do not share in God's glory. What a man earns by his choices are wages, while what God grants is a gift (Romans 6:23). Nothing could be more plain.

Why, even God Himself, cannot do that which is contrary to His will (Titus 1:2; Proverbs 8:23-21; etc. etc.)

For all of this I am exceedingly grateful, even beyond my ability to express it. If it were left to me, I would still be lost son of Jacob, resisting God continually. But God intervened on my behalf, freeing me from my hatred of Him, and creating a new creature... that I might choose Him and His will above all else.

In Him, Doc
19 Hyper calvinism and Backsliding? Note Bible general EdB Wed 08/17/16, 6:08am 243486
  I agree this is exactly the reason the SBF is not being used. I think we were having a good discussion. Nothing nasty or unsettling!
20 Hyper calvinism and Backsliding? Note Bible general Lionstrong Wed 08/17/16, 5:44am 243485
  Someone asked why are there so few posts on SBF now-a-days. This may be an example of the reason: not allowing open, honest discussion of difficult issues in God's Word.

I can see the restriction if we became ugly with each other, but that hasn't happened so far.

Well it said that it's a temporary restriction. Maybe they'll lift it in a couple of days.
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